Former Nissan CEO Carlos Ghosn sits down with journalist Hiroshi Sukagawa in Beirut, Lebanon to debate Japan’s “corrupt” justice system and his escape. A summarized model is under.
Interviewer (Sukagawa): Thank you for becoming a member of us at present. Beirut’s climate is kind of nice in comparison with Japan.
Carlos Ghosn: Yes, about 30°C — nothing in comparison with Japan’s warmth. Much extra comfy right here.
Interviewer: We’re not right here for a private profile, however to look at in depth what occurred on the day of your escape from Japan, and your views on Nissan. You’re often called the legendary CEO who turned Nissan from billions in debt right into a worthwhile firm. How do you view Nissan at present, and the way do you reply to being known as a fugitive and the drama of your escape?
Ghosn: Many questions there. Let’s begin with November 2018. My arrest was deliberate. It’s absurd for the top of a significant world firm, additionally representing a significant French company, to be arrested over unreported compensation—quantities neither determined, paid, nor finalized. In regular company governance, points are dealt with internally with prosecutors, correcting issues with out damaging the corporate. Hurting Nissan damages Japan—its workers, shareholders, and repute. Even former Prime Minister Abe stated I shouldn’t have been concerned on this. The board may have handled it internally, however they couldn’t take away me by way of the board or shareholders, in order that they used authorized means.
If a CEO is suspected of abusing methods, the right course is to droop them. But right here, the purpose was to fully neutralize me, take away me from the system, and get rid of the danger that Nissan may fall beneath Renault and the French authorities’s affect. Anyone can see the costs weren’t the true cause for my arrest.
After my arrest I investigated and located it was orchestrated. Prosecutors in Japan have a 99.4 p.c conviction fee, not due to plea offers, however as a result of they coerce confessions. Once indicted, it’s primarily over—attorneys and judges are irrelevant. They pressured me: confess and issues can be simpler; we gained’t go after your spouse, youngsters, or buddies. That’s recorded, however the tapes are withheld “for containing sensitive information.” The system is corrupt.
They cut up expenses to increase detention — 21 days for one cost, then one other 21 days for brand new expenses, threatening extra if I didn’t confess. I by no means confessed, in order that they re-arrested me. International stress lastly pressured them to grant bail—at $15 million, the very best in Japan. Yet I used to be beneath excessive restrictions, surveilled by cameras Nissan paid for, which was possible unlawful. This satisfied me I’d by no means get a good trial. Staying meant 10–15 years in authorized limbo, presumably re-arrested. At 64, that meant dying in that course of. So I deliberate my escape—one thing prosecutors would by no means anticipate, as nobody had carried out it earlier than.
For a 12 months, prosecutors managed the narrative: “Ghosn is greedy, loves money, committed major crimes.” I couldn’t converse to any media. When I reached Lebanon, I used to be free to reply. People name me a fugitive; I say I fled injustice. I’m not hiding—everybody is aware of the place I stay — however Japan issued Interpol notices for me and my spouse, on absurd expenses, purely to stress me.
Interviewer: You’ve stated there have been “rotten apples” inside Nissan. Why did they need you out?
Ghosn: They feared that if I finalized the holding firm construction for Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi, it could cement the alliance and forestall Japan from ever undoing it. I opposed a full merger—politicians favored it, however I most well-liked a good holding firm with no single controlling celebration. The French authorities wished a merger, which frightened some in Japan. Removing me was the way in which to break down the alliance—which certainly occurred.
Now Nissan and Mitsubishi are in bother. They even tried talks with Honda, which I predicted would fail—no synergies. Both have the identical strengths and weaknesses; mergers work after they’re complementary.
Renault’s then-chairman, Jean-Dominique Senard, failed in his position. He sat on Nissan’s board, knew the problems, authorised budgets, and oversaw selections that led to seven plant closures, together with Oppama. Poor management brought on job losses and a 70 p.c drop in Nissan’s worth—from over 1,000 yen per share to about 300 yen.
Interviewer: Japanese authorities say arrests are solely made with sturdy proof.
Ghosn: Nonsense. I used to be arrested on one cost (unreported compensation) with out a finalized or paid quantity. Other expenses got here after raids. This was about neutralizing me and dismantling the alliance. France reverted to its pre-1999 place within the auto business, with Nissan and Mitsubishi weakened and withdrawing from markets.
Japanese prosecutors even staged occasions for TV — claiming to arrest me on the aircraft, which was false because it was on the airport). They additionally confirmed packing containers taken from my house post-escape as in the event that they contained incriminating paperwork, which they didn’t.
I destroyed any paperwork they might twist into accusations—not as a result of I used to be responsible, however as a result of I knew their malice. Japan’s hostage justice system is medieval; lengthy interrogations with out counsel, “monitored” interpreters, recordings saved solely by prosecutors, no equity.
Interviewer: Did France additionally act in opposition to you?
Ghosn: Yes, after Japan requested it. In France, a mere grievance freezes belongings robotically as a “precaution.” This has dragged on for 5 years with out actual progress—France is following Japan’s lead.
Interviewer: About the Versailles controversy—
Ghosn: It wasn’t my wedding ceremony; it was our tenth anniversary, and a part of the Renault-Nissan alliance’s fifteenth anniversary celebrations, attended by 250 visitors, paid by the alliance, not by public funds. Two weeks later we held an identical occasion in Japan. The narrative was manipulated whereas I couldn’t converse.
Interviewer: Let’s talk about the escape plan.
Ghosn: I made a decision to flee 3–4 months earlier, after realizing a good trial was unimaginable. I examined a number of strategies earlier than deciding on the instrument case plan. It was year-end; airport workers had been short-term and fewer alert. My benefit was nobody anticipated me to attempt.
I prevented utilizing my monitored cellphone—used unmonitored ones and spoke beneath working showers to masks sound. I disguised myself in denims, low cost coat, informal sneakers, low cost watch, glasses—issues I by no means wore usually. In December, masks and hats weren’t suspicious. I stayed silent to keep away from voice recognition.
The field was delivered to an airport resort, not my home. I walked there, entered naturally, then within the room entered the case. It was about 1.5 hours inside earlier than boarding. I emerged solely after takeoff. From Kansai Airport to Turkey, then rapidly transferred in dangerous climate to a flight to Beirut. Landing in Lebanon at daybreak felt like a rebirth.
Interviewer: What was the very first thing you probably did after getting out of the case?
Ghosn: Drank espresso and water—wanted to relax. Then to my spouse’s mom’s home; she cried when she noticed me.
Interviewer: You’ve since been Red Notice-listed.
Ghosn: Interpol is only a software, following any member state’s request. But there’s all the time a approach round obstacles.
Interviewer: What do you do now?
Ghosn: I educate disaster administration, management, and technique at a personal college right here—sharing actual expertise, not idea. I additionally help lawsuits in opposition to Japan’s hostage justice system.
Interviewer: Will you come to Japan to face trial?
Ghosn: Never, except the system modifications fully and the harm carried out to me is acknowledged. In France I’m preventing the costs; if I win there, Japan’s case will look absurd.
Final message to Japan: For a 12 months after my arrest, the general public solely heard the prosecutors’ model, supported by Nissan and the Ministry of Economy. Even if I had carried out one thing unsuitable, the way in which they dealt with it was unsuitable. In actuality, I did nothing unsuitable—this was a setup, ready for months. Look at Nissan at present—factories closed, communities harm, hundreds shedding jobs. Would this have occurred if I had been nonetheless main? That’s my query to you.